Scam http://www.wg-gesucht.de/

I was nearly scammed for renting accommodation in Germany.

The website was http://www.wg-gesucht.de/

After sending out lots of emails to different potential houses, this is what I got from a man called Alvaro.
This was the email he sent me initially:

Hallo

I have have confirm you on skype but for now i will answer all your
questions,the caution fee covers you for as long as you living in the
apartment, and it is refundable when you are moving out of the
apartment,the contract will be sent to your mail for you to sign and
send it back to me to sign once i have confirm your interest in the
apartment, if you are moving in 24th of may, you can get the keys
before that date so that once you get to frankfurt, you will have free
access to the apartment, and you can only rent one room cos a danish
female student has already rent the other room and she will be moving
in 30th of june, the 350E you are to pay for the rent includes all
charges and you will not be paying any additional fee, i have wireless
internet facility in my apartment, you can reach me via my mail or
skype anytime. cos i just got to france today...Thanks and hope im
answered your questions...

Alvaro

He goes under the email address name [email protected], but he claims he is using his lawyer's email. He claims his real name is Alvaro. On Skype he wouldn't show me his face and only talked to me via audio.

This is his second email:

Hallo

I have have confirm you on skype but for now i will answer all your
questions,the caution fee covers you for as long as you living in the
apartment, and it is refundable when you are moving out of the
apartment,the contract will be sent to your mail for you to sign and
send it back to me to sign once i have confirm your interest in the
apartment, if you are moving in 24th of may, you can get the keys
before that date so that once you get to frankfurt, you will have free
access to the apartment, and you can only rent one room cos a danish
female student has already rent the other room and she will be moving
in 30th of june, the 350E you are to pay for the rent includes all
charges and you will not be paying any additional fee, i have wireless
internet facility in my apartment, you can reach me via my mail or
skype anytime. cos i just got to france today...Thanks and hope im
answered your questions...

Alvaro

Long story, but the landlord firstly asked for my Full Name, Address, Date of Birth and Passport Number. This was initially before signing the contract. I couldn't do it personally, because I am in the UK.

I gave him my details (I searched up online beforehand and apparently is seems a normal thing for landlords with international clients to do before signing contracts) and then he asked me to transfer money 900 Euros via Western Union. Once he asked for that, I knew it was a scam and didn't bother with him any more.

This was the 3rd and final email I got from Alvaro:

Hallo, i have explained my situation to you, i just want you to know
that Sophie has her keys already, i can't use my German account cos it
was dormant before i left for France, to give you some kind of
security, i could send you a scan copy of my passport ID, and i
already told Sophie about you, she asked for your mail did not give
her cos i don't know if you will like it but i have to give it to you,
so you could talk to her, please you have to let me know, before i can
send you the contract, thanks, her mail [email protected]

Alvaro

This is what I replied to him with:

Hi Alvaro

With you asking me to send you money via Western Union , there have been a lot of scams online. What I've read is that the landlord will ask the tenant to send the first months rent and deposit and then the tenant sends them the receipt and the landlord is never seen again. Not that I'm saying you're going to scam me out of my money as you seem a very genuine guy so far, however even WG-Gesucht says that I shouldn't send money via Western Union Money Transfer to a landlord.

Since you must have a bank account somewhere, I would like to do an International bank transfer or send the money via Paypal. It then gives me peace of mind knowing that my money is protected and reinforces the fact that you're genuine.

I asked him if I can send the money via International Bank Transfer or Paypal and he gave some silly excuse. How can a bank account go dormant

I believe he is also under the name of Adrien and has multiple properties on the website. I got this very similar email from Adrien, also under a different email name called [email protected]

This is what I got from 'Adrien':

The flat is Well furnished 2-Room-Apartment,the flat is ideal for
rental. the apartment has two bedrooms attached with separate bathroom
and Toilet and a modern spacious kitchen (fit-in appliances) such as
central heating,gas,double glazing,dish washer.The flat is located at
Alt-Griesheim 12, 65933 Frankfurt am Main, The apartment is situated
at the second floor of the building, the entire flat cost 700e per
month and a caution fee of 750e which is refundable when you are
moving out of the apartment..while a room cost 350e and a caution fee
of 550e.all charges such as electricity, internet, cost of gas and
water.are included in the monthly rent..if this suite your need do not
exit-ate to reply via the e-mail. you can also add me on Skype. My
Skype name is mlh5551

Adrien

He also said a Danish student had already taken up the second room in the two room apartment. He provided me the email address and asked for me to get in contact with her: [email protected]

These are the emails I got from her, I asked her questions about how legitimate Alvaro is and this is what I got back:

hi... It realy feels good to hear from you, Alvaro told me about you, i asked for your mail but he did not give it to me, i will be really glad to live with you, well let me introduce my self, my name is sophie norgaard, i am a danish student from Aarhus, Jutland Studying journalism. i am 24 years old, Am calm, friendly and have sense of humor, i will be coming to frankfurt on the 30th of june for a six months intership, that is why i had to rent to rent alvaro's apartment, But i have the keys already, i took the second room, cos it looks more simple and that is what i like though, as for the genuineness of Alvaro apartment, i can put it to you that i have the keys already, i was in the apartment on friday i went there myself after getting the keys, if you want any prove i could send you a copy of the Dhl delivery receipt that was send to my mail after he sent the keys.It's a pity i don't do facebook cos it might affect my Education, and i don't want anything that will make me look concentration in my studies... i will be glad if we could share some pictures...sophie

Second Email:

Hey, I really don't have time to answer all this questions, the apartment is Alvaro's and not mine, does he know you are doubting him like this, cos it will make him feel bad, i think, i have the keys and i have been to the apartment, what other prove do i need, i have no reason to doubt him cos i have been to the apartment, i attached a picture of me with the Dhl receipt that was sent to me, you don't really have to doubt Alvaro, he is a gentle and nice man that deserves more than this...Sophie

This is quite obviously Alvaro pretending to be someone else or one of his colleagues.

She also sent a generic picture of a 24 year old girl and attached an DHL certificate, which really looked fake.

Alvaro is also currently in France somewhere (he didn't say where) and as extra proof he even offered me to sent me a copy of his passport and a picture of himself (which could mean absolutely anything).

He sounded like he came from Africa, but I have no idea where. Most probably Nigeria.

His usernames on http://www.wg-gesucht.de/ are: kerw & jamesrt

DO NOT MESSAGE HIM, just report the ad.

I've reported his ads on http://www.wg-gesucht.de/ and hopefully they will be taken down!!!

Annoyingly however he does have my personal details, what can he do with my Full Name, Address, Date of Birth and Passport Number? I'm worried that he'll use them for identity theft or even fabricating another passport. I also sent Sophie a picture of myself as well (as she suggested getting to know each other better and she doesn't have Facebook apparently).

Hello Light_of_Aeons!

All though it's not ideal it's also not something to really worry about. These scammers are after easy money not really to steal your identity. They just ask for those details to seem legit.

Can you please post the scammers information like his email address, phone number initial emails to you? This may help others who search the details avoid the scammer.

Justin

Thanks for the help Justin! That's made me worry a lot less!

I had the pleasure of dealing with Adrien today. Luckily i didnt fall for it and checked things out. Hes advertising a place in stuttgart. After signing a 'lease' which he was putting me under pressure to do so i went to the apt as Im in the city. Met a neighbour who told me the person didnt exist and that there was someone in the apartment.
How do I report him>>?

Hello Everyone,

I am also struggling with those scammers in wg-gesucht website. And I have to say, nearly %30 of the apartments I apply are scammers

I have found an easy way to understand if the person contacts you is a scam! If you are using gmail, go to the person's email, look for the small arrow (called "more) next to the Reply button and click it. You will see some advanced reply options which one of them is "show original". If you click this, you will get the whole package of info about the mail including the sender's IP. (for hotmail its called "x-originating" and for yahoo its "replied from") There are many so just try all IP s if you are lost and try to locate them. You're gonna see most of the scammers are sending mails from South Africa and Nigeria. That's either a gang located in this place or they are simply using proxy IP (which is a much higher chance) to hide their whereabouts...

Mostly when I ask this, they stop contacting me and never answer to any approach; which proves that they are scammer.

Here are the scammers so far:
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]

I hope that would be useful.

Best,
Hasan

There is a very large cell of scammers of this kind operating in and near Nigeria--the African IP's are usually real, though it is likely they will lead to an internet cafe rather than an individual's home.

I just wanted to point out a couple of other quick things.
-Gmail does not always reveal IP, depending on how the user sends emails. So often, if you receive an email from a scammer using a gmail account, it will trace to Google's headquarters in California instead of the true location.
-messages sent via blackberry can also give some erroneous location results.
-some scammers do use proxies to hide their true locations--those proxies will typically make them appear to be in the US or Europe. Scammers who use proxies typically choose these areas because they generally raise less suspicion.

In other words--an IP that points to an area with a very high scam rate is a definite reason to consider an offer a scam; but an IP that doesn't point to a high-scam area is not a reason to consider an offer real.

I was also almost cheated by [email protected] while renting an apartment in Copenhagen.

Thanks to the blog and you guys I found out it is a scam!

I waqs writing to him via skype and told him " doesn't matter anymore, I know you are a scam". He logged out and deleted me from the friends' list without saying nothing.

Thank you again for reporting him!

hey guys!!

I just made the same experience as you did.

a guy called Daniel Schindler offered two rooms in Munich for 350 a month, deposit 550.
he used the email address [email protected] .
he said to live in Reading in England ( DANIEL SCHINDLER
11 Simmonds Street, Reading RG1 6QF UK) and wanted money to be transfered by Money Gram.
He also did the Sophie story ("sophie mardine norgard" <[email protected]>) and this girl added me at Facebook. But she only has 19 facebook friends who are more or less all kids. the same as you said, he sent me a copy of his passport and a contract.

this was his message

Hallo,
I am offering out my 2-bedroom flat ..The flat is Well furnished
2-Room-Apartment,the flat is ideal for rental. the apartment has two
bedrooms attached with separate bathroom and Toilet and a modern
spacious kitchen (fit-in appliances) such as central heating,gas,
double glazing,dish washer, washing machine .The flat is located at
Arcisstraße 38,80799 München The apartment is situated at the second
floor of the building, the entire flat cost 700e per month and a
caution fee of 750e which is refundable when you are moving out of
the apartment..while a room cost 350e and a caution fee of 550e.all
charges such as electricity, internet, cost of gas and water.are
included in the monthly rent..if this suite your need do not exit-ate
to reply via the e-mail. you can also add me on Skype. My Skype name
is d.schindl011

the address exists, but it is in Maxvorstadt, an expensive area.

additionally, a guy called ejengo nawer with the email <[email protected]> did the same with a room in Munich and used the skype account name Roger Zapata.

this was his message:

Thanks for the response... Before we discuss further, let me give a
brief description apartment... The flat is a fully furnished 2-bedroom
apartment, The property is ideal for rental the properties in the
apartment includes gas central,double glazing, heater, 2 bedroom. Each
of the room has bathroom with a washing bathtub and toilet attached to
it. And a large kitchen with appliances which include dish washers,
the room is furnished with a double size mattress, reading table and
wardrobe . It is located in central neighborhood, at Ainmillerstraße 4,
80801, München at the second floor of the building, the monthly
rent which includes the cost of gas, electricity, internet, water
costs 740 and 800E caution fee but if you are renting a room in the
apartment it cost 360E plus a caution fee of 560E . if you are
interested, do not hesitate to reach me via my e-mail or my Skype. My
Skype name is Rogerolides . Thanks and hope to hear from you soon.

Roger Zapata

I hope that anybody who is going to send a message to them and googles the names finds this warning.


Do never ever ever send money via Money Gram. Just don't. Do not be that naive.

Hi,

i have the same here. The guy, ROGER ZAPATA wrote in english as a response to my german language letter. My german is fluent so i didnt need him to write in english...probably doesnt even speak german. So first impression was the language he used and of course the old stupid story about he just relocated to England so he can't show the apartment...the messages are straight to the point and not personal. BIG SCAM.

Address for the apartmend he gave: Ainmillerstraße 4, 80801, München at the second floor of the building
Email used: ejengo nawert <[email protected]
skype given :Rogerolides

and he is the only one who responded me without showing the original ad ,which apartment he was offering on the page. so i can't tell neither, although i asked him to link me the ad but he ignored.

good luck guys, be smart, f*ck the scammers...

Hello everybody,

I think I have look your website to late... I gave money despite the fact that it smells bad. And now I don't know what to do. I have a copy of Roger Zapata's passport, (fake ?)... and they have a copy of my french identity card.
I have to go in München at the end of August for my studies, during one year, and starting in those conditions will not be great. I think there is nothing to do (?)...

Aie

hey "Aie"!

that sucks that you did not read it before.

But there is at least something you can try (which I did and I got my money back).
(See previous entry by me)

Well, I told the police, because obviously the copy of the passport the guy sent me was not his own, so it is fraud or identity theft which might be interesting for the police.
Then I wrote to money gram and had some phone calls. I told them everything and forwarded them the mails I wrote with the guy.
What they found out in the end is that they handed out the money to someone who obviously was not the one I indicated on the sending formular, which means that not Daniel Schindler, but "Daniel Schindler" picked up the money which should not have been the case. So it was their fault, maybe they did not compare the face on the passport to the one that picked up the money or so.. and this week I go my money back.

I was told this happens once in 1000 cases, but at least you can try and report it.

And I have more interesting names and cases for Munich:

aditu iyinj:

Hi ,
The room is 16m2 each, and located at Thalkirchner Straße
9,80337 München , Germany very clean with a lovely kitchen,living
room,private bathroom and toilet. There is washing machine and dish
washer,including internet. Each room is furnished with a double size
mattress, reading table and wardrobe . It is located in central
neighborhood. The room is 350Euro plus a security deposit of 570Euros
While the whole flat cost 700Euros plus a security deposit of
750Euros.The security deposit is refundable at the termination date of
the lease contract . Write me an email or talk on skype for further
informations.
MY SKYPE ID: Geremygaudibert.26 ...... Thanks and hope to
hear from you soon
Jeremy


dammy kelebe:

Hello,
I look forward to rent out a bedrooms in my home at Bauerstraße 17,
80796, München, Germany. The whole apartment has just been renovated
and refurnished. The rent includes heating , hot and cold water,
electricity, water heater, and each room with its own bathroom.
kitchen, Living room and balcony are shared, you can also have your
own visitors, the apartment is located in Central City, public
transport and supermarket are just in a stone throw distance . Each of
the room in the flat cost 400 euro which include all other charges
such as electricity,water supply, cost of gas , internet etc . Caution
fee is 550 euro which is refundable when you are moving out of the
flat. Contact me for more information if you are interested.
Marcus


louise david ([email protected]):

Hi ,
The room is 17m2 each, and located at Korbinianstraße 55 ,80807
München, very clean with a lovely kitchen,living
room,private bathroom and toilet. There is washing machine and dish
washer,including internet. Each room is furnished with a double size
mattress, reading table and wardrobe . It is located in central
neighborhood. The room is 350Euro plus a security deposit of 550Euros
While the whole flat cost 700Euros plus a security deposit of
750Euros.The security deposit is refundable at the termination date of
lease contract.write me an e-mail and i hope to read from you
soon.David........Thanks

iuyu olio:

Hi ,
The room is 16m2 each, and located at Schwanthalerstraße
135,80339 München, Germany very clean with a lovely kitchen,living
room,private bathroom and toilet. There is washing machine and dish
washer,including internet. Each room is furnished with a double size
mattress, reading table and wardrobe . It is located in central
neighborhood. The room is 350Euro plus a security deposit of 570Euros
While the whole flat cost 700Euros plus a security deposit of
750Euros.The security deposit is refundable at the termination date of
the lease contract . Write me an email or talk on skype for further
informations.




MY SKYPE ID: Geremygaudibert.26 ...... Thanks and hope to
hear from you soon
Jeremy

this one: https://www.wg-gesucht.de/4106513.html is also a scam

Thank you for your email regarding the available room,it is a room in a furnished 3 bedroom shared apartment,neatly furnished and not far from the University,viewing not possible for now,because I am in Finland working so we can only deal on internet so if you're interested get back to me so that I can send you the picture of the flat and after that we proceed to contract and then payment,we can as well chat on skype(bamise101)

Hannes

[email protected]

got another one:

Hello

Thanks for the response... Before we discuss further, let me give a
brief description apartment... The flat is a fully furnished 2-bedroom
apartment, The property is ideal for rental the properties in the
apartment includes gas central,double glazing, heater, 2 bedroom. Each
of the room has bathroom with a washing bathtub and toilet attached to
it. And a large kitchen with appliances which include dish washers,
the room is furnished with a double size mattress, reading table and
wardrobe . It is located in central neighborhood, at Kirchenstraße 2,
81675 München at the second floor of the building, the monthly rent
for the whole apartment which includes the cost of gas, electricity,
internet, water costs 740 and 800E caution fee but if you are renting
a room in the apartment it cost 360E plus a caution fee of 560E . if
you are interested, do not hesitate to reach me via my e-mail or my
Skype. My Skype name is Alex_corne . Thanks and hope to
hear from you soon.

Cornelius

email: [email protected]

That one, like the preceding ones, has the writing style of a West African. "Caution fee" makes no sense in English and is a calque from German, but everything else about the writing shows that he is no German nor in Germany and just copy-pasted phrases to look German.

This guy was still operating on the website up until last weekend under the name David Tobias Nickl where he scammed my girlfriends daughter out of over 400 pounds. We contacted the site and had all his property ads frozen. I am now on his trail and this has led me to a West African living in New Delhi, India. I have IP addresses and also a telephone number that he gave me. Is it appropriate to post the details here? My investigations continue and I will update this topic as I find out more.